Grinder symbol



  • Another thing to keep in mind is that we will have more bio-mod hackers in this movement soon too.  I am trying to get some gene replacement guys on here, and they will probably be pretty focused on non-electronic projects.
  • I like this slogan, if it can be incorporated:

  • @DirectorX Oh yes, that's gorgeous.
  • "No flesh shall be spared"? Is that the translation? It seems a little hostile.
  • @Jack I see what you mean.

    I like the look of the top one best, but the bottom one would work best as a tattoo i feel.
  • @Version2: This is hard for me to explain, partly because I think it so poetic.  Here is an excerpt from a website that does a better job than I would at explaining it:

    "Soon we'll either be gods or extinct; either way, the flesh is finished. To quote Bart Kosko: "Biology
    is not destiny. It was never more than tendency. It was just nature's
    first quick and dirty way to compute with meat. Chips are destiny.""
  • edited January 2011
    The Gear-Eye looks nice. Perhaps too nice.
    Perhaps something simpler? Like a DNA chain being smacked with a wrench, or one that's been repaired with duct tape?
  • @AxiomaticBadger that sounds great, if perhaps a little difficult to get across in a logo. ",)
  • I really like the eyes, though I can't decide which one is the best .
  • NULLI CARNI PARCETUR rendering the flesh
    null... it is poetic... can 'nature' be rendered null? nature, as in a
    default creation due to a slow or inadequate evolution--or habit

    Does 'logo' have to be thought of in static commercial terms? What
    if a slogan is the logo? The words and letters can then find form in
    endless ways, depending on the hack medium. A very basic example,
    they're Roman alphabets, but can also be braille and binary.

    Visually, I see this as a combination of some comments above (quite literal though):

  • edited January 2011
    @xarene I disagree with your interpretation of 'NULLI CARNI PARCETUR': I would not synonymize flesh with nature. And whatever the future, flesh is a transitory medium.

    I specifically avoided referring to the graphic as a 'logo'  because of the word's commercial connotations. Visually, I prefer the strength and immediate impact of a symbol, maybe with an attached slogan. 

    Punk and other subcultures have their own, we should too. It ties us together as what we should be: a global movement, not just disorganized hobbyists.  
  • Nature isn't suggested as a synonym of flesh; I gave it as an alternate option. Nature is a given, where through nurturing (emotional, physical, etc.) it is capable of changing--basically changing our nature is important to any movement dealing with enhancement, prosthesis, singularity etc. The idea is for a future where we've moved beyond the flesh and on to more structural issues of humanness.


    Whether referred to or not, a logo is a visual element (a picture, a word, a dot, whatever) with given meaning by an organization and used for their recognition. When you make something to identify Biohack, it becomes a logo for Biohack. My suggestion is to think of that identity in terms of a fluid object, capable of changing based on the need, whether it is a graphic or text. Static means it's one thing and that's it. In metaphoric relation to the movement, we can say we're human and that's it. But, we're moving towards other options of human, so the identity of Biohack should reflect that idea. That's why I said it should not be static, as in one image.


    Y'all should read too. Good people there; you'll like it.

  • @xarene: "The idea is for a future where we've moved beyond the flesh"

    Don't take this the wrong way, but I don't agree with this at all. I'm interested in cybernetics because it's (to me) another level of body modification. 

    I enjoy my flesh, and the pains and pleasures it experiences. It's the reason I do this:


    To get straight to the point, I found myself in my flesh. I have a hard time dealing with emotional pain, it's like it's happening to someone else, not me. Physical pain helps me feel the things I should but can't. I would never dream of giving up my flesh, which is what the basic message of "NULLI CARNI PARCETUR" seems to be. I don't find this poetic, I find it disgusting.

    But, it might just be that the saying seems to be something more of a transhumanist motto, and I don't think of myself in those terms. I consider myself human, and only human. Parts of biohacking do spill over into transhumanism, and vice versa, but that doesn't mean the two terms are interchangeable, or that all biohackers share a transhumanist perspective. Personally, I don't care about what comes after humans, I most likely won't be around to see it. I'm much more concerned about what can be done right now, with existing tech to amplify sensory experiences.

    And like I said previously, the saying is simply hostile. As of right now, humans are all flesh. Saying that flesh is not the future is pretty much the same as saying humans are not the future. It's not something that I can get behind, it's not a friendly message to me at all. I'd honestly rather take up something completely cheesy like "Beauty in Biology." At least it's positive.
  • That brings up an interesting point. Remain philosophically neutral? Say fuck it? Is it even possible to be neutral when it comes to this topic? One of my friends from my 'I wanna be a piercer' phase was disgusted by the idea of implanting magnets in my fingers. This was the girl I did most of my personal piercing practice with, and she couldn't understand extrasensory modification. My biolab partner who I've known for two weeks? Intrigued! Biohacking means something different to all of us, I think. So should the logo and/or slogan be neutral? Should it be a great big fuck you to conservative minded folk who reject our experiments? Biohack is, in itself, a very strong name. Do we need a slogan? The logo doesn't have to be complicated or well thought out. Just vaguely original and easily related to biohacking. A smiley face with a gear for an eye. A scalpel and screw driver. Anything. This thread seems far too over thought out.
  • We're hackers; the point behind what we do is freedom. We're at our best when our philosophies embrace the ability to choose.
    And I utterly agree with your last sentence, Ffaway. ",)
    Hell, who sez we need a single unified symbol? I love niko's geared biohazard thing above - when I go home tonight I'm cutting a stencil of it. Some of the other ideas also look or sound fantastic, they're all really distinctive, and all (fairly) clear on the meaning. We're not a company, we don't need a logo. These kind of symbols are a tribal thing; having several that mean the same thing is fine. (",)
  • edited January 2011
    I can't agree less with both of you. ( @Ffaway @Unqualified )

    Firstly, having a symbol that is associated with a larger group is certainly not tied to corporations. Religions, political organizations, anti-political organizations (arguably), the aforementioned medical services (and other public works), international organizations (the Olympics, United Nations, etc.), and the list goes on and on. A logo is not a tool for "corporate domination", but a valuable tool in order to quickly identify a common footing among a community or organization. Language is only suitable on a local level. The icons that make up the word "biohack" are unintelligible to people unfamiliar with the language, are illiterate, or even simply unfamiliar with the group. "Biohacking" could simply mean an interest in GMOs. 

    A single icon unrelated to language serves a potentially larger role.

    Secondly, each of the proposals in this thread do not mean the same thing. As has be pointed out several times already, the aspects of certain symbols are interpreted differently to different members, some of which find them contrary to the goals of the movement at large. You are (of course) welcome to use and iconography that you wish to represent yourself, but the ability to represent a group as a whole cannot devolve into a personal exercise.

    If anything, this thread is far too under-thought.
  • @xarene I'd be interested in hearing any ideas that you have in creating a "fluid" identity.

    I can certainly see having a continuous bounding shape with multiple "cores" that affect the meaning. I think that the UN has done that kind of identity quite well, allowing them to adapt to the creation of new (sub)committees.

    There is also a possibility to bring in a technological component; either having a logo that regenerates itself out of given mathematical constraints, or a logo that taps into the amount of searchable information and imagery online. Both of those have also been exploited in interesting ways.

    Daniel van der Velden talks in this video (Vimeo, around 18 minutes in) about rebranding WikiLeaks as a series of Petri dishes, each containing a different image pulled from Wikileak's "image economy". Perhaps something similar to what you imagine?
  • image

    I like this. :D
  • edited January 2011
    Rather than identifying one as part of a group I for one wish to identify myself with an idea or subculture. Neither of those are exclusive, I can partake in more than one, and I agree that many signs or logos seems more right than making a single one. The point of not having one logo is also that this would separate groups of biohackers and it would turn it into "them" and "us", while I think it should be "us" and "our guys over there"..

    I think that "biohackers" and similar terms have been used are enough. Hacking is an expressive word, and the bio is pretty clear I think. You can easily translate this into most languages and so it speaks for itself universally.

    Reminds me of the evolution smiley!

    About slogans my personal slogan drives me in this as much as anything ^^

    Accidia Occidere
    Alternatively Accidiam Occiderum or Tepiditatem vincere, more expressive but I like to keep it simple.. Gotta learn better latin maybe.
  • edited January 2011

    @Shiprat Punk is a subculture. Punk has a popular symbol; individuals within punk adopt varying personal symbols which are not the popular. Picking a symbol does not mean you, personally, must adopt it.

    A symbol raises awareness and promotes solidarity. We have a presence on the Internet: forum, github, Facebook page. It would be convenient and to the benefit of and grinder subculture to adopt a visually obvious symbol.

  • Is there a way to organize a vote? Some sort of poll function on the forum? I would end this discussion with a chosen symbol before it trails off with no decision having been made.
  • @Jack and I are still drafting concepts. There are still many unexplored alternatives.
  • edited February 2011
    How about a more stylized version of the Adeptus Mechanicus icon (Warhammer 40,000)?

    This here is a rather detailed take on the icon:

    Skull = humanity
    Gear = machine
    Augmented skull = both as one

    Also, as for a slogan, how about a "ring" of "THE FUTURE OF MANKIND BUILDING THE FUTURE OF MANKIND BUILDING (and so on)" wrapped about the image, as a sort of never-ending mission statement?
  • I would protest being so openly tied to any preexisting source. This applies both to Dr. Sleepless and 40K. Why should we imitate preexisting material when we strive to not imitate much.
  • Still poking around at getting some of the DokSleepless iconography released into the wild under Creative Commons. That said, I fully support the idea of not marrying your logo to any existing commercial concerns.
  • edited February 2011
    @CBPye @nemogrinds You can run with this without being derivative. The human head has powerful connotations. The challenge would be stripping it down to its essential elements while still communicating the idea of a post-human face.

    It turns more difficult when we think of its potential to alienate people. Uncanny valley anyone?
  • @CBPye :  I'd rather not have our symbol be something so ... aggressive (?) looking.  Sure, it is badass, but it doesn't help PR.  
  • @SovereignBleak While the symbol does have the potential to alienate us, I think the scars and implanted chunks of metal do a better job.

    Personally I like Niko's cog / biohazard sign. It looks awesome, and it'd help me scare off the fleshpeople if I got a big one tattooed in a prominent spot.
  • @SixEcho: I have a stencil of that made up. Re-branding of my bag and suchlike to follow. ",)
  • edited February 2011
    @SixEcho We only hurt ourselves if our goal with a symbol is to promote fear. 

    By adopting the symbol for "biological substances that pose a threat to the health of living organisms", do we mean to imply that we are the threat to other living organisms? I don't see any other implication as the metal we implant is not a biological substance.
This discussion has been closed.