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So you want to put a magnet in your finger…
I would be concerned with the mechanical properties of the ZrO2. Also, I always worry about things that are great at osteointegration. Has a tendency to do weird things then not used for bone work...
I agree, I have the same concern as im not sure how the body will react if it thinks the implant is bone. And Zirconium bio ceramic is as close to bone as it gets. But the ceramic is a mixture of a few different elements and may be worth look at. I thought it could shatter easily but according to tests its pretty strong
just watched saal, first things first. epic background music. thankyou for the video as well. Looks like you need a spotter for sure. I started my hunt today for someone who i would trust to do this for me. Which is hard pressed to find. Living in salt lake city there are few reputable shops of any kind that do this kind of work. One guy told me that implant type body mod work in the slc area in general is kinda hush hush. watching your video i feel a lot better about a home procedure. i would still like someoen else to do it for me though.
on another not i heard someone in an earlier post mention laser/ obsidian scalpels as being optimal for this. I am curious if you yourself looked into this before doing your implant. I have some experience in geology and even fashioning crude arrowheads from obsidian. i can personally attest that it is the most painless and effortless cut i have ever seen. using pressure flaking to get the grooves in an arrow head you often get a piece in the palm of your hand through several layers of leather. some of the flakes you knock off of your core piece end up like fine scalpel blades. and it theoretically woudl be sterile as well. volcanic glass that has been sealed until the blade was fashioned. standard preop treatment on it would make it way clean. another interesting thing is that the cuts i have received from obsidian are way cleaner cuts than those of knives. and seem to heal quicker. i would be interested to see if there is any evidence of getting less nerve damage, quicker healing, and perhaps and more intimate nerve regrowth around the implant. i know that obsidian is or was at some point the blade of choice for eye surgery. i can imagine the quality of the cut would go something like laser scalpel> obsidian>surgical steel scalpel.
edited May 2014
so i am curious if you have any relative sensitivities between your wrist and finger magnets. like spatial perception. not unlike how you an place where someone is in the room by sound. have you tried tracking an object like a bottle cap or even something electric from forearm past your fingertips then back a few times. This experiment would be best conducted in a sensory deprivation environment, however i understand if you dont have one. I am super disappointing and also really curious about the discrepancies between you and experiences of the wrist implant. i am super interested in having symmetrically dispersed arrays of a few magnets in each arm to see if you can gain a better perception of the fields around you. kinda like having 1x1 rx tx chain on your wifi vs having 2x2 or 3x3 mimo. I am also curious about the wrist band project you are working on as i was thinking of doing a glove project that would work with my implants. i have a friend that does work with raw carbon fiber and he makes cycling gloves for downhill mountain bike racing. it wouldnt impact the magnetic fields and it woudl be a great lightweight sturdy mount for the foundation of an interfacing device for implants. you should pm me if you want collaborate
Short update on my work. I am trying to play catchup on a lot of the things you guys have already started. I ordered some really pure obsidian slabs to make some fine scalpels out of. From what I am reading the edge of obsidian can be several times sharper than a conventional surgical scalpel. Nerve regrowth I feel is an area we need more info on. If we could have a cleaner healing process and more intimate nerve placement around the magnet I feel we could yield better results from implants. Not to mention this would also make it a safer practice for alternate locations of magnets where nerve damage is a problem or concern.
will a hard-nickel process electroplating degrade in the body? I'm really new to all this, i just am very familiar with this and a couple of other electroplating procesess and have worked with them successfully(not inside people, just in utilitarian uses)
nickel as a rule is a no-no in the body. Look up bio compatible coatings and you'll find a list. generally TiN is the best or something like teflon.
thank you sir, sorry, I just blurted out something I happened to be familiar with without thinking, it was inappropriate, but if there's ever a coating that can be applied via electrodeposition, I will always be happy to help come up with new teks.(obviously electrodeposition isn't hard, but you know how people tend to over simply it to a kindergarten science-fair process, which is maybe true, in like two out of hundreds of finishing applications)
rodya, why are you apologizing? Lol, just curious. You're just curious. Science is all about asking questions about things you don't understand. :) Oh, hi everybody. I've been lurking for the past month. I read this entire thread in about 2 hours. This is really interesting and I can't get my girlfriend to understand the reasoning behind it. Even though she loves science. At least she doesn't complain about the safety issues. I would have to let her know that I have enough experience in the recreational self-mutilation department to be able to do this. Wouldn't be the first time I put a foreign body in my body. ;) Anyway, hi everyone!
To be honest, darkzero, I'm just a bit lacking in the self confidence department, but I'm improving that! I'm only 23, and I want both to live and to learn, for as long as technology will allow some form of my conscious mind and it's memories functioning. Right now I know very little compared to most in this community, even the area I want to major in when I finally start college, but I will find a way to become better and learning more and more....I wish there were a more systematic approach to learning for me, but all I've found so far is that self study is better for me in the context of things that can't be simulated...In my personal life, most of my friends and people when I was in high school acted like I was a genius, but I knew that, relative to many people my age...I know so little
Hm. I like your outlook. I'm kind of in a similar place. Starting school in January. Going for CIS and electrical engineering. Plus whatever other courses I can get my hands on with financial aid. I'm thinking about getting magnets during the summer. Possibly spring. It's exciting and I know we will have more uses by then and I'll have more resources to play with.
Would getting it in the tip of the finger be better or the pad? And would it be fine to implant it under your fingernail? That way it can be bigger and not interfere with rock climbing or something similar.
I'm going on a leg here but i think the magnet seems to be right in front of a few major nerves heading towards the tip of the finger. I may be wrong but you should check for yourself on the biodigital human.
edited January 2015
while nickel plating would be bad inside body because it's highly allergenic, as far as I know gold is pretty much neutral (with some natural antiseptic/disinfecting properties). And while I'm not very familiar with electroplating technology, I think it can be used to deposit a layer of gold on surface of an implant. That _could_ be effective as an implant outer layer to make it more biocompatible.
There's a reason why forcing splinters under someone's nails was a popular torture in medieval times and even now is used quite successfully. You don't want anything under your nails - it'll hurt like hell. Even if it'd heal there, every time you apply pressure at your nail it could hurt. Besides that doing anything with nailbed has chances of permamently damaging its matrix and disfiguring your nail for life.
Gold would be fine except it is soft. Doesn't work really well as a coating because repeated forces will eventually break it down in short order.
ok so i got some n52's silver plated. how do i biosafe them to be ready for implanting? they're 3x3 mm
Wouldn't gold plating despite its softness be still ok for implants like magnets, where there are no moving parts and except for someone banging the hand against something hard (which can damage almost any but titanium coating) would have no big forces working against the coating? Plus gold is pliable - it doesn't break very easily, instead it can stretch a bit under force, possibly making it even better as possible coating. As far as I know gold is one of materials that is sometimes used in medical grade implants too...
i was thinking. what about plastic coating?
seems that it would be very hard to break down and pierce?
This is a converstaion that has been talked to exhaustion, I promise. "Plastic" is not something you want to put in your body. As far as bioproofing, it sucks. Gold will break down in as much as shear forces will smear it till it stops working.
Please read through the previous threads on coatings. Also, I believe Cassox has a good recent post about the variety of magnet coating types and why certain things are being used.
And there is a titanium nitride coating available, so yes, that is a good coating.
This thread has now long outlived it's usefulness as a coherent topic. If you've come here to post something, please instead look through all of the
category to see if someone else has already asked the same thing (most likely: yes).
This discussion has been closed.
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