TDCS questions

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  • @McSTUFF

    I'm still hoping to control this thing with an Arduino.  I think, with a relay, I should be able to just short out one of the resistors to raise the power.  With two relays, I could turn it on or off and adjust the current using the Arduino.

    A variable resistor would be easier if I give up on using the Arduino.  I probably will not use it in the permanent version but I want to learn how to build and program Arduino circuits so this seemed like a good project.

    Somewhat off topic but I'm currently playing with an ATtiny85 chip (like a miniature Arduino) with the intent to build a lucid dreaming mask.  To start, it will just be set up with a timer but I want to incorporate an eye movement detector eventually.  Depending on how complex the TDCS program becomes, the same ATtiny85 might work and make a smaller, cheaper device that is still microprocessor controlled.
  • @Birdhandz, that makes sense. There are potentiometers that can be controlled by an Arduino. They're called [digital potentiometers]. If you're starting with Arduino stick with your method of mechanical relays, it'll be a lot simpler. I just wanted you to know that they exist.

    How do you detect eye movement on closed eyes?
  • Question do you think is possible to add an EEG to it? To control the result of the tDSC ? 
  • edited September 2016
    @McSTUFF

    Thanks for the info about the digital potentiometers. 

    I haven't figured out how to detect eye movements yet but here is one place with some information on how it could be done.

    @BirdMachine posted a link in another thread to the bottlenose Arduino files.  It included a file called sleep that recorded the number and times of REM sleep.

    I'm not exactly sure how it is set up but it looks like a potentiometer is somehow used to detect the eye movements.

    I'm going to try it first without any eye movement detection and just use a timer to wait for an hour or two to fall asleep and then flash LEDs in a pattern every ten minutes.  Hopefully, that pattern of flashing light will be noticeable in a dream and alert me that I am dreaming.  I don't know yet if the lights will actually wake me up.  I might need to change the brightness or the pattern if it does.

    I did get the ATtiny85 chip programmed to do what I wanted but, even with such a TINY microprocessor, I still had unused pins and memory so I am now trying to make it a little fancier with two separate LEDs and want to make the right and left sides flash separate.  I soldered up a bundle of three 'AA' batteries to power the circuit.  The plan is to fit everything into a sleep mask without needing wires running to and from it.  Watch type batteries would probably work if it turns out 'AA' or 'AAA' batteries are too heavy.

  • @Bridhandz, do you post your progress on any blog or maker site? I'd like to keep tabs on your progress with these projects.
  • @kuroro86

    I would like to try EEG to see what is happening.  I'm not sure if it would work at the same time as the TDCS was running or if that would mess it up but it would be nice to see what (if any) changes happen before, during, and after the TDCS session.

    I'm missing the special spiker shield that amplifies the brain and nerve signal enough to detect but all of the schematics are available to build it yourself.
  • @McSTUFF, I don't have any blog of anywhere other than here where I have posted anything about my projects.  I tend to lose interest and move on to other stuff pretty often so it is very possible a lot of my ideas will never happen.

    The TDCS and the Lucid dreaming mask probably will be made though.  I'm waiting for the relays to get here from China to hook up the TDCS but I have pretty much everything to build the sleep mask already.  Just need to figure out the program and then wire and sew it together.
  • @Birdhandz, I know what you mean. When I was in my twenties I couldn't finish a project, no matter how cool, to save my life. I had to push myself to complete something and I did that enough times that it finally became my habit. Now I'm able to complete some pretty neat stuff. Neat to me anyway.
    One thing that inspired me to keep building was this talk by Adam Savage. [10 Commandment of Making]
    I won't embed the video since it's not related to this thread.
    Keep tinkering.

  • Thanks @kuroro86.  That is an interesting site.  Using the same electrodes to both stimulate and record sounds like a good idea.  I'm not sure how to do it but it is something to consider.

    I have done some more work on my Lucid Dream Mask and plan to try it out tonight.  I wanted to use it last night but I needed to make some programming changes first.

    I'm not sure if this counts as biohacking so I didn't start a new thread here about it.  I did just throw up a webpage where you can read a little more about it and download my code if you want.  Not sure how updated I will keep that page but here it is.

    DIY Lucid Dream Mask


  • edited September 2016
    P.S.  There is already a product similar to this called Remee.  Better prices on Ebay but they do have some good ideas.  Online programming using black and white squares is one nice idea.  It would take some work to do yourself but sounds possible with a couple photoresistors and the right programming.
  • Well, I messed up the sketch for the lucid dream mask  so I didn't get to test it out last night.  I used int values for the sleepDelay and patternDelay which couldn't hold as large a number as I was giving it.  It made the thing flash with very little delay.  Also, the brightness was too high so I dropped it down.

    I switched it to unsigned long instead of int and it should work now.

    Hopefully tonight I'll try it again.
  • I'm not sure if bumping an older thread is frowned on here or I should just start a new topic but:

    I have been trying to write up some information for a tDCS wiki entry and have been searching old threads on this forum and other sites. 

    From this threadchironex posted:

     "Secondly, if you reverse the electrode by accident, you make yourself a weeeee bit really stupid.

    We
    had the electrodes at f3 and the right shoulder but got them backwards
    by accident. Has this sort of thing happened to anyone else? If so, got
    any funny stories?"

    This is the exact montage I have used most of the time.  I keep trying different positions but always come back to that one.  I purposely reversed the electrodes Anode (+) on my right shoulder and Cathode (-) at f3.  I described the effects as almost a drunk feeling.  Definitely not the same effect as the other polarity.



  • @Birdhandz: Sorry for asking about something posted a long time ago, but where did you get that tDCS electrode placement diagram from? I've been basing my montage on a couple of studies where f3 and f4 are associated with memory and learning, not motor planning, so I'' wondering if I can get a source on that. Thanks!
  • edited November 2016
    @IvoTheSquire

    To be honest, I was trying to do the DARPA montage from this site.

    The pictures on that site confused me and I mixed up the right and left sides.  It sure looked like a mirror image to me.

    I did try the "correct" placement but I prefer the way I accidentally did it in the beginning.  I didn't care for the reversed polarity in that position though.

    I continue to experiment looking for another montage that I like but I haven't found anything better for me.  I'm sure everyone's brain is a little different.  My theory is that if that area of the brain is already firing, then stimulating it with tDCS probably won't help.  If it is not active, then the tDCS might help turn it on.

    The same thing seem to be true if you reverse the polarity.  If the region of the brain is already inactive, I don't think tDCS will turn it more off.  If it is active, then the reversed polarity does seem to make it less active.  That may or may not be a good thing.

    Obviously you should be careful with experimenting on your brain but that might be the only way to find out what works and what doesn't work for your own needs and wants.

    EDIT to add:  The "drunk" feeling was not really a stumbling around slurred speech type of feeling.  More just a cloudy mind.  Not able to stay focused.  There did seem to be an increased awareness of sounds but that just made it harder to concentrate on any one thing.  I might try it again someday to see if it was just another placebo but it wasn't something I cared to repeat.
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