The biohack.me forums were originally run on Vanilla and ran from January 2011 to July 2024. They are preserved here as a read-only archive. If you had an account on the forums and are in the archive and wish to have either your posts anonymized or removed entirely, email us and let us know.
While we are no longer running Vanilla, Patreon badges are still being awarded, and shoutout forum posts are being created, because this is done directly in the database via an automated task.
First Attempt at Magnetic Implant Failed. Looking for Advice.
Hey everyone! Three weeks ago I implanted my first magnet. It was an m31 that I put in the middle finger side of my ring finger using the scalpel method. 8 days after being implanted, the edge of the magnet was suddenly peeking out of the scab with the magnet sitting at an angle, and I had to dig it out. This rejection was unexpected because, until that day, it hadn't looked unusual based on other peoples descriptions, besides for healing kind of slow and minor bruising for one day a few days after the procedure. It tingled frequently, but didn't hurt so I assumed it wasn't rejected because of infection. I have a few questions before I attempt to implant the magnet again.
1) Is it a bad idea to implant the magnet into the same finger, but on the pinky side? This finger is by far my least used finger besides my pinkie. My "surgeon" is nervous about implanting in my pinkies because of their small size. All of the damage from the first attempt takes up about half a centimeter of width, and is located on the left third of my finger pad so there is just over a centimeter worth of undamaged finger width that I would use. Also, I won't be implanting it until at least 4 weeks after removing the first attempt.
2) What would have caused the first rejection if it wasn't infection, and how can I prevent it on my next attempt? I am using sutures instead of butterfly bandages this time, and I am going to try and place the magnet farther from the incision site. Last time the envelope made was just big enough to get the magnet to lay flat and have the incision close over it. This was because, being the first attempt, we were learning on the fly and the procedure was taking longer than I would have liked to have the tourniquet on my finger (plus the numbness from icing wasn’t preventing much of the pain anymore). Also, how far laterally from the incision should the incision side edge of the magnet be when implanting?
Any advice is greatly appreciated. Also, I have pictures of my finger as it tried to heal/was rejected that I can upload if it helps anyone. Thanks!
Comments
-
"I am using sutures instead of butterfly bandages this time"
Not using a stitch might be the cause here.
-
In reference to the size of the pocket, @Cassox recommends 5mm total, so you'd have in the neighborhood of 2mm between the edge of the magnet and the incision when it is inserted.
-
link to album: https://imgur.com/a/D8KNYI didn't annotate the pictures on imgur, so here is their description.
- 10 hours after surgery
- 2 days after surgery,
- 4 days after surgery,
- blurry but 5 days after (I rarely played with my magnet intentionally during the attempted healing process)
- 8 days after. barely peeking out
- 8 days after with some scab removed
I removed my butterfly bandages every day or two starting two days after the procedure so I could clean the area with isopropyl and rinse it with sterile saline and also replace the bandages. Is a scalpel the best way to separate the dermal layer from the adipose tissue for the pocket? I have seen some videos where people use scissors instead. -
shouldn't be cleaning with iso. it dries the area and can cause rejection. Sterile saline only for the most part. You either need stiches or superglue, not jsut a butterfly closure. Without enough pressure to hold the wound closed it WILL open if anything bumps it. Stick to protocol next time and it should be fine.
-
Good to know about the iso! I was thinking that it must have been rejected because of irritation pushing it up through the butterfly bandages. Also, I did an iodine swab before starting the procedure. I know they do this before surgeries and blood donations, but is there any reason to not do this before implanting the magnet? I hadn't seen anyone mention it that I can remember.
-
I got my magnet about a week ago and i pretty much did the same thing you did. I did put superglue when the procedure was done and that helped but with the bandage my finger started sweating and the sweat made my skin all wrinkly. Some puss came out yesterday so i squeezed it all out and cleaned the wound with some sterile saline.I applied a butterfly bandage to apply pressure and this morning it looked much better but i'm still unsure that it will be permanent. If you want some pictures just ask and ill upload them.
-
Hopefully you can keep that clean and in! Be careful that you don't leave it in if the infection doesn't go away though.Does anyone have advice about using the same finger for my next attempt?
-
@Ebingle, my personal advice if you're doing a repeat on the same finger would be to make sure it's nearly fully healed before you do it. I redid all four of mine after the failures of my scalpel implantations (did needle-based implantations for the second go around) but in each case, the finger was nearly fully healed. I also, in two of them, used the opposite side of the finger.
-
@aviin what type of needle do you use? I was going to use the needle method and had purchased an 8 gauge piercing needle, but decided against doing it that way. But now I'm thinking it may be a better option.
-
The needle I used on all four m31s was the needle of an RFID injector. That's a 12G needle, supposedly, though I think that's a 12G regular-wall hypodermic as measured in the medical industry. Gauge sizes get really confusing the moment you start comparing hypodermic sizes versus piercing needle sizes, though.
Hypodermic needles are gauged according to their inner diameter while piercing needles are gauged according to their outer diameter. So the two sizing conventions don't match up exactly. Here are two very useful links for understanding sizings: Hypodermic Needles and Piercing Needles. Comparing the two, you'll see that a 12G hypodermic is about the size of a 9G piercing needle. I spent a good number of hours researching needles for my upcoming m36 implantations before I stumbled upon the fact that these two different conventions exist. Hard-earned information I'm happy to share here. I should get this info into the wiki, come to think of it... But I digress... Anyway, the 12G hypodermic is definitely a little smaller than the magnet, which adds a bit of difficulty. I went with 8G piercing needles for the m36s. I'm hopeful that they'll do the trick nicely once the m36s ship.
Do carefully consider the perhaps greater risks of needle implantation before you proceed. They've been done far less often (so far) than scalpel implantations and the technique is not nearly so refined. I know of a certainty that I was into tissue that @Cassox, at least, highly recommends one not damage. I'm of the opinion that @Cassox is the fucking man when it comes to implanting magnets, so take what he's said as the gold standard. I had huge successes with all of my needle implantations, and there are certainly some advantages to this method (a smaller break in the skin which means faster healing, which reduces the chances for infection, being the primary one), but you do take on a larger degree of risk in going this route.
*EDIT* - I now think my understanding of needle gauge sizing was incomplete when I wrote this post an hour or so ago. To make it all very simple, hypodermic needles have outer diameters equal to their gauge on the Birmingham Wire Gauge (BWG) standard and piercing needles have an outer diameter equal to their gauge on the American Wire Gauge (AWG) standard. This table will show you the outer diameter of essentially ALL hypodermic and piecing needles.
-
Did you make the pocket 5 mm deep laterally from the insertion point like you would in scalpel implantation?
-
I went further than that. In the neighborhood of 10mm. I was very concerned about them being pushed out during healing and I wanted to be sure that wouldn't happen.
-
@aviin I am slightly allergic to bacitracin (produces minor swelling and irritation, which is bad for a healing implant), so I have to use less effective antibiotic cream. Because of this, do you think needle implantation would be better as it has a smaller opening and less chance of infection?Also I've seen some people commenting about fish cin lately. Does anyone know if this is better than other antibiotics such as Amoxicillin? And do you need to take it for a period of time following the implantation like other antibiotics?
-
I took fish cin (clindamycin) and used no other antibacterial or antibiotics. 0 complications. I would imagine using fish cin and a weak antibiotic would be even better.
-
Finally getting ready to reimplant. I'm still looking at the needle method into the other side of the same finger. It's been 6 months since my first attempt was removed so I feel like I'm healed enough. @aviin are you still happy with your decision to implant with a needle?
-
Yes, very happy.
